Joanna Stern, Nilay Patel, light up the Talk Show WWDC 2025 edition

16 June 2025

Joanna Stern, technology writer at The Wall Street Journal, and Nilay Patel, editor-in-chief of The Verge, were this year’s guests on the live edition of John Gruber’s Talk Show podcast at WWDC last week. It’s the first time in ten years senior Apple executives have not appeared on the WWDC edition of the show, having “declined” to participate this year.

Some speculated their absence was on account of an article Gruber wrote in March, critical of Apple’s delays in rolling out enhancements to Siri, the iPhone’s digital assistant, and Apple Intelligence, an array of AI features the company suggested — at WWDC 2024 — were close to release.

Gruber addressed the nonattendance of Apple executives, typically Craig Federighi (SVP of software engineering), and Greg Joswiak (SVP of worldwide marketing), saying there had been some degree of discussion between him and the company on the matter, but didn’t go into detail.

Some people, including Stern, believe their non-participation is temporary. Others, however, see things differently, with one pointing to a preview screening, at WWDC, of Brad Pitt’s high profile new movie, F1, co-produced by Apple Studios, which was scheduled to coincide with the Talk Show.

I’m not sure Apple’s no show was entirely a bad thing though, and the presence of new faces, and perspectives, was refreshing. While it’s WWDC, and attendees want to hear senior Apple executives speak informally, the format can be a little predictable. All the way down to Joswiak sitting vigilantly on stage throughout, making sure no one speaks out of turn, though this is also somewhat amusing.

Gruber is sometimes chastised for being soft on the Apple people, and shying away from asking hard questions. But I doubt a “tough” approach would be productive. Apple will only ever the answer the questions they want to. Gleaning insights by way the fireside chat format is probably going to be more informative. That said, Stern put Federighi and Joswiak through the wringer, in an interview she recorded with the pair, prior to her appearance on the Talk Show.